L1049G Problems in Icing Conditions

[dc6tryer]

Hi,
I've tried to find this AFSD program, but without success. Could someone point me in the right direction, please!

Andy.

[Tom/CalClassic]

Hi,

pagesperso-orange.fr/hsors/afsd.html

Hope this helps,

[ashaman]

I added the missing 1513 section to the Starliner as well (she did not have it). Now have to find myself a potential heavy icing condition to check the behavior of all three Connies.

[sunny9850]

May 24, 2009 23:44:26 GMT -5 flugkapitan said:

Stefan,

Thanks for making the files available!

Cheers,
Scott
KJMS (or thereabouts)

No problemo....all the thanks need to go to Tom for finding the solution. I only have an old version of AirEd and it shows 1513 as so I completely ignored it when I was looking for the answer.

Stefan

[Tom/CalClassic]

Just a quick post to avoid people thinking this is my discovery. FSAviator brought it to my attention a while ago, and I think he got it from someone else (but I can't remember that right now).

Thanks,

[Ricardo Miranda]

Hi!

Thanks to both Tom and Stefan for these files!
I had lost my AFSD!

Soft Landings!

[ashaman]

Must try, in the next days, to use the Starliner with the original, backed up .AIR file without the 1513 section... the darn thing has re-started overheating in descent... is it ever possible that the adding of a anti-icing section can cause that problem?

[dc6tryer]

Hi,

Is this #1513 in the Air File called " Vacuum Loss Related"?

I ask as #1518 relates to PropDeice and that seems to be missing in most planes as well and I wondered if there had been a misprint .

I know I shouldn't fiddle about; only pain and tears will come from it.

Andy.

[Tom/CalClassic]

What FSAviator sent to me:

For Structural Deice:

1513 = 1 and 0, or 1 and 1
1519 = 1

For Prop Deice:

1518 = 1 (0 if the plane does not have prop deice).

Hope this helps,

[emb110]

Charles (Dutch) Owen created an ice gauge that would indicated when icing occurs as well as a full explanation on how to add the required settings in the air file. You may find the file over at FlightSim, look for ice10.zip

[sunny9850]

Looks like we need to do a little more detective work on the ice....on a couple test flights yesterday I ended up with mixed results.
In pre-set light icing turning the system on seemed to work fine shedding the ice weight but did not work in pre-set moderate icing.

Stefan

[emb110]

Here's an excerpt from Charles Owen
"But the most important settings are in the .air file. If these are missing
or mis-configured (and this is the problem with many of the default FS9
airplanes) no matter if you have your aircraft.cfg settings correct and your
gauge code right: your plane won't de-ice until you have three special
records in the .air file.

These are, specifically, the 1513, 1518, and 1519 records. The 1513 record
contains two numbers. I do not know what these numbers represent but I know
that if this record is missing or the numbers are zero, de-icing won't work
on the airplane. On those default FS9 airplanes that have the 1513 record,
for jets the first value seems to be 1 and for all others it is .15; but it
doesn't seem to make a difference that I notice. I always use 1. The
second number always seems to be 18. So, if your airplane doesn't have a
1513 record, place one with values of 1 and 18 in the two numbers.

The 1518 and 1519 records are very simple. The 1518 is a switch with a
value of 0 or 1, that enables prop de-icing. This is a value that is
overridden by the setting in the aircraft.cfg. Obviously, set this to 1.
The 1519 controls wing de-icing. There are three possible values: 0, 1 or
2. Zero means no wing de-icing is available. I suspect that 1 or 2 selects
between the two common de-icing systems (heaters or boots), however, in
actual practice I can't see any difference in the results. So let's just
say that a non-zero value here enables wing de-icing."


Hope this helps
Rob

[capflyer]

One has to remember that most of these aircraft were not certified at any time (most especially today) for extended flight into anything more than light icing. Even modern aircraft can be overwhelmed fairly quickly by ice.

Aircraft with a boot system are setup for de-icing, i.e. being able to shed the ice after it's formed. They do not work to prevent it. These aircraft are usually okay into short periods of moderate icing, but anything above that should be avoided and if encountered, immediate steps should be taken to get out of it. Aircraft (especially pistons) with thermal or electrically heated leading edges should not be trusted in anything more than light icing. With the CV-240/340/440 aircraft, for example, while the aircraft is still certified for flight into known light icing, most pilots will tell you that they get out of it as soon as they see anything because the system doesn't work that well and definitely does not keep the wings clear of ice, much less the tail.

[sunny9850]

Thanks Rob for the enhanced detail...we're doing some more testing right now and once we have that sorted for sure I'll update the little zip again.

FIKI is definitely one of those strange areas in the rule books.
The FAA had been using a DHC-6 equipped with all sorts of measuring equipment and a lot of extra de-icing equipment.

And yet the airplane still departed controlled flight on a couple of occasions when on the hunt for ice.
Really weird things happen to a normally tame airplane with just a small amount of ice in just the right places.

I had one icing encounter in a C-206 and if I never have to live through anything like that again I am perfectly fine with that.
I'd go as far as saying I'll take a inflight engine failure on a single over that on almost any day.

Stefan

[sunny9850]

download687.mediafire.com/xy25zyynkcmg/kzul25t1yxz/Updated+Air+Files+L-1049-L-1649.zip

Or if the direct link doesn't work:

www.mediafire.com/download.php?kzul25t1yxz

Ok I have checked and re-checked it one more time tonight and now with all the sections added she will get rid of the ice weight.
All at once which is a little unrealistic....but I guess better than not at all.

I have also made the modifications for the Starliner L-1649A.

Cheers
Stefan