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Post by FSMuseum on Sept 19, 2014 9:17:29 GMT -5
Hello friends! In case you haven't kept up with the recent news, I'm starting a new project called Canada 1960, which is exactly as good as it sounds. Canada is a sorely blank area on the classic map, so I'm gonna fill in all the major airports and possibly some smaller fields.
Currently, the following airports are being done: Toronto-Malton Montreal Dorval Halifax St. John's Ottawa Gander Winnipeg Calgary Edmonton Vancouver Yellowknife Frobisher Bay (Iqaluit) Downsview Toronto Goose Bay Windsor London YXU
If there are any major airports I missed, or any others you would like to see from Canada, do let me know, as I have plenty of resources available.
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Post by Maarten on Sept 19, 2014 9:37:34 GMT -5
Hi Chris,
That is fantastic news! I'm looking forward to the result.
Cheers, Maarten
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Post by pliddell on Sept 19, 2014 9:41:25 GMT -5
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Post by FSMuseum on Sept 19, 2014 10:09:40 GMT -5
I could probably get those in, though Cartierville looks a bit more challenging since the vast majority of the airport is no longer there
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Post by rally on Sept 19, 2014 11:36:35 GMT -5
YES!
Awesome, awesome, awesome. Maybe this will get me to start on a project I have had in mind for years: RCAF 1960 AI.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2014 12:00:45 GMT -5
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Post by deltalima on Sept 19, 2014 12:18:00 GMT -5
Already used up a lot of air time yesterday - but just a note to say "awesome mega-project" of Europe 62 and Africa 62 proportions.
We almost always say "can't wait" - which expresses our enthusiasm - but in truth, happy to wait and let these come to fruition in their own time.
Thanks again for taking these on.
Daniel
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Post by FSMuseum on Sept 19, 2014 12:34:34 GMT -5
I was sure someone else had one underway. If ifiniti doesn't mind, I could make my own, or take what they have and finish it, or let them finish it and stop my own before it gets to going. I'll send a PM
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Post by chris_c on Sept 19, 2014 12:38:20 GMT -5
Excellent, thanks in advance! Amongst my very earliest of memories is my Father taking me to Malton Airport to watch the planes come and go. This would have been starting around 1962 or so; the Connies were on their way out but I am sure that I visualize at least one triple-tail, the Viscounts, Vanguards and DC-8's would have been in evidence and there was construction everywhere, impressive enough to register in a child's mind. I recall the incredible noise, the smells of kerosene and hot rubber and the huge red and white airliners, awe inspiring sights to a seven-year old.
Dad loved airplanes but hated flying, probably a hangover from his wartime RCAF service.
I am very much looking forward to this scenery so thanks again.
Chris
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Post by deltalima on Sept 19, 2014 12:45:40 GMT -5
Yes, that would be awesome. I experimented many years ago, but was ground down by lack of suitable AI models. Now, with AI Chippies, Harvards, Sabres, Voodoos, and Starfighters, it's now within the realm of the possible. Between John Young and Mike Pearson, AI Cold War choice has really heated up nicely. A few gaps exist with CF-100s and Banshees, and a few helos and transports - but I'd say the minimum critical mass is there. I'd look at in when hard winter sets in. RCN Shearwater would be lovely too - www.shearwateraviationmuseum.ns.ca/history/index.htm... as would RCAF Comox .... 67.69.104.76:84/rcaf-atc/photos/comox/comox-10.jpg67.69.104.76:84/rcaf-atc/photos/comox/comox-1.jpgI tried to adapt the wartime BCATP to the 50s, but the parking, inability to remove the statics (I really like them, but would have liked to have trimmed then down a bit to make room for some AI) made me shelve the project. Even if no dedicated RCAF/RCN stations materialize, at least with some airports, we could add in some reserve Sabre Units to these new proposed Calclassic airports.
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Post by Dennis the menace on Sept 19, 2014 13:45:46 GMT -5
Sounds like a great project!
If you're going to create a 1960 scenery, make sure that your "1960" runways are long enough to handle the jets that are present in the CalClassic 1962 traffic, otherwise the 1962 CalClassic traffic users will be seeing jets overrunning the runways. Many airports around the world did not have jet traffic in 1960, and it wasn't until 1961 to 1964 that many of the runways were lengthened. The DC-6B that flew off the runway in 1960 might very well be a DC-8 by 1962, and with a short runway, well....disaster!
Also please be aware, that if you rename any of the runways, you will lose all the approaches and transitions, and the ILSs will show up as unattached to the now renamed runways. Using ADE to rename the runways and then to edit the approaches and transitions will prevent this. If you do not know how to edit or create approaches and transitions, it is best to not rename runways at all.
Hope this helps
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Post by jwh on Sept 19, 2014 18:47:00 GMT -5
Chris I have mid fifties charts for all of those airports including Frobisher and late fifties for some of them in an old Northwest Jeppesen manual. Please let me know what you need and I am happy to do my little bit to assist. Retirement gives one so much more time for these things and being in Australia it is great to learn more about aviation in other countries.
John
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Post by rally on Sept 19, 2014 19:16:31 GMT -5
Yes, that would be awesome. I experimented many years ago, but was ground down by lack of suitable AI models. Now, with AI Chippies, Harvards, Sabres, Voodoos, and Starfighters, it's now within the realm of the possible. Between John Young and Mike Pearson, AI Cold War choice has really heated up nicely. A few gaps exist with CF-100s and Banshees, and a few helos and transports - but I'd say the minimum critical mass is there. I'd look at in when hard winter sets in. Actually, CF-100s are not a problem, as the Alphasim freeware one is simple enough for AI work. 1960 would be a year too soon for Voodoos, and the only Starfighter would be the Lockheed-built CF-104 pattern aircraft 12700 flying around Cartierville. There are AI North Stars and Britannias in the CC core AI pack, the latter could stand in for Yukons. The one that stumps me is the Argus. I don't recall ever seeing one available other than as static scenery. As far as scenery, there are already some very nice 1 Air Division airfields including Metz, Marville, Grostenquin, Lahr and Baden.
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Post by Defender on Sept 20, 2014 6:40:32 GMT -5
Hi Chris,
That's great news. Canada is such a beautiful and varied country to fly around.
A few points.
As Mike says, ADE is worth using so that you can add approaches for renumbered or now disused runways. It was that problem that caused ATC/AI to recognise only one runway in your Boston release. I think I've edited one or two others as well.
As for your list, Goose Bay was an important civil and military airport but I'd like to see the main city airports get priority. For those who can't wait for the other places mentioned in this and the Toronto thread, go to the flightontario site as deltalima recommends. The "leapfrog3" package has a whole range of the North Atlantic staging posts. Also flightontario and flightsim host a huge Goose Bay download and apart from a relocated civil terminal Goose hasn't changed much since 1960. However I get a lot of system crashes there possibly because the scenery is so complex and if you ever get around to producing a slightly simpler version that would be great.
For Frobisher Bay CYFB, there's already a lovely but modern version by Sydney Schwartz but again the layout hasn't changed that much since 1960. I backdated that one myself with quite a few exclusions (including his gorgeous 1970's yellow terminal unfortunately) and reinstating the by 1960 disused gravel strip. The main runway is still the same 9,000' as in 1960 except that 200' at either end are not now classified as runway.
As for the cities, 1960 runway lengths should not be a problem. Vancouver's 08/26 was already 8,600', Toronto Malton had 11,500', Winnipeg 8,700', Calgary 8,675', Edmonton 11,000' and Montreal Dorval 9,600'. However, make sure that only these longer runways are given ILS approaches in ADE so that, as Mike says, DC-8's and 707's don't use other shorter runways. AI gives priority to these ILS runways except in really extreme cross winds. I think you know that you simply add these ILS approaches in the ADE "approach" window for use by AI. Is doesn't require an actual runway ILS frequency, ident etc if none existed in 1960.
Good luck
Bill
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Post by jwh on Sept 20, 2014 7:13:50 GMT -5
Hi Chris Have uploaded charts and pics for Dorval to my Flickr page and created an album as well. Be wonderful if both pre 1960 and post 1960 versions could be done.
John
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