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Post by ddawson on Jan 26, 2019 18:28:04 GMT -5
I'll try that tomorrow thanks. Would be good to see Mike's problem resolved. But what is it that seems to stop the existing gauge working only on the default DC-3? The existing version works fine on all the Connies, DC's etc so no need to replace on these? Bill I wish I had an answer for you. Suffice to say that the gauges I wrote 12 years ago were somewhat less than good - at least as far as this particular application goes. Certainly, if you have a working solution, don't fix what isn't broken. Doug
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Post by Defender on Jan 26, 2019 18:34:34 GMT -5
Thanks. It's the first and only time I've seen a problem with realistic start and I use it on all my favourite aircraft.
Bill
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Post by mdeval on Jan 26, 2019 19:53:14 GMT -5
Am using a third party panel and a 3rd party cfg., though right off I can't tell you whose. Do you think I should revert to default everything and try the start feature from there ? Also keep in mind that the Howard 500 has the same issue and tweaking the starter torque has no effect.
Mike
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Post by ddawson on Jan 26, 2019 20:34:25 GMT -5
You shouldn't need to revert back to the stock configuration. Just comment out the existing engine_start gauge and put the entry in for the one I compiled today. If you're not sure, post the panel.cfg file and I can give you specifics.
Doug
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Post by Tom/CalClassic on Jan 26, 2019 22:29:42 GMT -5
Hi,
Thanks Doug. I'm just reading your messages on the FSD forum now.
It does create a nice single gauge solution for Ctrl-E. A couple of minor points when I tested it on my DC-6B:
1. The initial rotation speed is a little slow, and there is a "hitch" in the rotation about twice a second. 2. The still prop animation lasts too long, and thus I can see a "kickback" just as the engine catches. I avoided this on my radial start gauge by controlling the RPM until the blurred prop rotation was engaged.
Of course, I also use your fantastic Engine Control gauge to control the RPM during starts using the panel's engine start gauges, so I'll need to keep using that one.
However, you did manage to do something that the old Engine Control cannot do - and that is work OK the first time you load a plane during an FS session. When I try that using the Engine Control gauge all the props instantly spin at maximum speed. Is there a way to incorporate that code into the Engine Control gauge?
Thanks again,
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Post by Defender on Jan 27, 2019 9:41:23 GMT -5
Mike,
Sorry I can't offer much more help but Doug Dawson's latest gauge does prevent the backward flip and system freeze although it needs a bit more fine tuning.
Doug/Tom,
I'll email Doug with some comment. Just some background on the DC-3 problem. With the old realistic autostart gauge, the aircraft didn't flip immediately on loading up. It would load, then go through its 10-12 blade slow rotation and only flip at the point that it would normally fire up. That's why I originally thought it might be starter torque related. I also checked out the sound and smoke effects files that would take up at that point but no luck. As I said, it works perfectly on every other aircraft I've used it on.
Bill
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Post by Tom/CalClassic on Jan 27, 2019 10:30:14 GMT -5
Hi,
Perhaps the difference lies in the Contact Points section?
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Post by Defender on Jan 27, 2019 12:29:41 GMT -5
Tom,
Success. Not the contact points but that gave me the idea of copying sections from my C-47 aircraft.cfg, which I know works, into the default version and it turns out to be something in the [piston_engine] section. No idea what.
Mike,
The existing realistic start gauges should work in the DC-3 if you paste and overwrite the following into the default aircraft.cfg. I'm 99% certain that this all comes from the Beaumont and Bitzer DC-3 upgrade and if the following section works for you then I strongly recommend you download and install the entire B&B upgrade as it makes no sense just to use a non-matching section. Good luck.
[piston_engine] power_scalar = 1.0 // DO NOT CHANGE Piston power scalar BB=1.2 cylinder_displacement= 130.71 //Cubic inches per cylinder compression_ratio= 6.7 //Compression ratio number_of_cylinders=14 //Number of cylinders max_rated_rpm= 2700 //Max rated RPM max_rated_hp= 1200 //Max rated HP fuel_metering_type= 1 //0=Fuel Injected, 1=Gravity Carburetor, 2=Aerobatic Carburetor cooling_type= 0 //0=Cooling type Air, 1=Cooling type Liquid //normalized_starter_torque= 0.01 //Starter torque factor normalized_starter_torque= 0.10 //for realistic autostart turbocharged= 1 //Is it turbocharged? 0=FALSE, 1=TRUE max_design_mp= 50 // was 47 Max design manifold pressure, (inHg) BB min_design_mp= 6 // was 10 Min design manifold pressure, (inHg) BB critical_altitude=2000 //was 7000 BB emergency_boost_type= 0 //0=None, 1=Water Injection, 2=Methanol/Water injection, 3=War Emergency Power emergency_boost_mp_offset= 0 //Additional manifold pressure supplied by emergency boost emergency_boost_gain_offset= 0 //Multiplier on manifold pressure due to emergency boost fuel_air_auto_mixture= 0 //Automixture available? 0=FALSE, 1=TRUE auto_ignition= 0 //Auto-Ignition available? 0=FALSE, 1=TRUE max_rpm_mechanical_efficiency_scalar= 1.0 //Scalar on maximum RPM mechanical efficiency idle_rpm_mechanical_efficiency_scalar= 1.0 //Scalar on idle RPM mechanical efficiency max_rpm_friction_scalar= 1.0 //Scalar on maximum RPM friction idle_rpm_friction_scalar= 1.0 //Scalar on idle RPM friction
Bill
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Post by ddawson on Jan 27, 2019 13:03:01 GMT -5
Gentlemen, Thanks for the feedback. It is helpful. I've been banging my head against the wall trying to figure out why the existing gauge requires a reload before it works properly. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I'll keep you posted if I make any progress, or if I can fine tune the new gauge a little better.
Doug
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Post by Tom/CalClassic on Jan 27, 2019 13:19:57 GMT -5
Thanks Doug, that was an odd one for me too, I couldn't think of a reason. I just hoped you had already come up with a solution. My reload gauge does the trick for now.
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Post by gaab on Jan 28, 2019 16:05:10 GMT -5
gauge57=dsd_radial_engine_start!engine_start, 2,2,10 The gauge is using FSUIPC to control engine and prop rpm, so your starter torque won't matter. Doug Hello,
Now that we are getting some converted models to P3DV4 (DC6 and L-1649), any chance to get a 64kb version ? (without FSUIPC would be great)...
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Post by Tom/CalClassic on Jan 28, 2019 16:08:15 GMT -5
Unfortunately the required FS program code was removed in FSX and I don't believe it was added back in P3D, so this is FS2004 only.
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Post by mdeval on Feb 10, 2019 20:27:33 GMT -5
OK, sorry it's taken so long to get back. As I said before, the Connie's were remedied by tweaking the starter torque. After many different combinations of this and that, I got the default DC-3 working by using the Bitzer and Beaumont cfg., and the Doug Dawson gauge entry. That does however produce an erratic motion to the props. There's a VERY slow initial rotation speed. Then when the engine starts to "catch", the prop makes a very jerky motion sort of like a strobe effect before it finally fires into full rotation speed. I can live with that but it'd be nice to be able to smooth the whole process out. As for the Howard 500, still no luck despite all combinations of things I've tried.
Undaunted however and will keep working at it out of pure stubbornness.
Thanks all for your help, MIke
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Post by Defender on Feb 11, 2019 14:34:49 GMT -5
Mike, Sorry it may not have been clear earlier but do not use Doug Dawson's latest gauge yet. It's still under development. The older gauges should now work for you with the [piston_engine] config settings listed in my Jan 27 post and the panel settings below meantime, gauge11=CC_Engine_Control!Engine_Control, 8,8,5,5 gauge12=Douglas_DC3!ENGINE_AUTOSTART_2, 5,5,11,11 gauge13=Douglas_DC3!AIRCRAFT_RELOAD, 10,10,11,11 //gauge14=dsd_radial_engine_start!engine_start, 2,2,10 This gives me a smooth blade count, although 3 to 4 rotations before firing whereas 2 rotations might have been more typical. Very occasionally there's a slight hesitation before firing but not consistent, probably video related. Bill PS - Have you tried Manfred Jahn's FS9 version of the C-47? Not as detailed as his FSX version but still a huge improvement on the MS default. It uses the same modified default configs as described before. www.flightsim.com/vbfs/fslib.php?do=search&fsec=0&fname=c-47_basepack_fs9.zip
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Post by Tom/CalClassic on Feb 11, 2019 14:55:39 GMT -5
Bill,
The prop rotation during starting seems a little fast. If you add this line to each fltsim section your start may be a little more realistic:
prop_anim_ratio=0.8
If that line exists already, change it 0.8.
Hope this helps,
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