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Post by Col7777 on Dec 6, 2008 4:30:04 GMT -5
Something that popped in to my mind recently, with all this talk of cost cutting and fuel prices etc, where do airlines get the money to get new aircraft, do they actually buy them or do they lease them? The cost of a new aircraft is very high, in fact I don't know the price of a new aircraft but do they get new aircraft to keep up with competitors or what? I've read to buy a new aircraft is more expensive than may be buying 2 not so older aircraft that can do the job equally as well. I recently read that some countries are choosing not to buy aircraft from Europe because of the EU ban on their airlines, I didn't realise the list of banned aircraft in Europe was so large. The ban apparently is imposed because of poor maintenance and/or accidents, I would presume other countries also have bans of this nature I never got that far in to looking it up. This brought me to flight sim, you hear talk of accuracy in the sim but it made me wonder how many are flying banned aircraft in to their country without knowing, see we can break the rules in flight sim can't we?
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Post by Tom/CalClassic on Dec 6, 2008 10:21:45 GMT -5
That's one of the big advantages of FS - you can do what you want. Airlines both buy and lease aircraft, depending on their needs. If they buy them, they get loans from a bank for the purchase, just like any other business. Depending on their financial situation, the advantages and disadvantages of each (taxes, cash flow, down payments, etc.) will decide the issue.
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Post by jesse on Dec 6, 2008 12:14:53 GMT -5
Just finished checking and reading all my email and I still have a little allocated time left so I thought I would thow in a comment on the buy or lease question.
In General Aviation there is a popular term used called Buy and Lease Back. Say for example your local Cow pasture airport FBO is also the Cessna or Beech dealer. He sells you a new C-182 and then you immediately turn around and lease it back to him so he can use it in his flight school or rental department. You are still the owner and as such still have access to the airplane when you feel like a turn or two around the pasture. You are not tying up any of your asset in this transaction. At the termination of the lease, the bird remains your property.
Jesse
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Post by Col7777 on Dec 7, 2008 4:14:43 GMT -5
Thanks for replying Tom & Jesse,
I also read that some companies instead of sending their employees to meetings where they have to fly they are now looking at video conferencing. So where a rep might make a routine flight say once a week the cost of his/her ticket every week it is cheaper to set up the video conference.
If my memory serves me correctly, wasn't there a fuel crisis a good few years ago where they found it cheaper to tow aircraft to the runway rather than have them taxi, a study was done and it did work out that it did save a lot?
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Post by qxtoolman on Dec 7, 2008 9:32:13 GMT -5
Thanks for replying Tom & Jesse, If my memory serves me correctly, wasn't there a fuel crisis a good few years ago where they found it cheaper to tow aircraft to the runway rather than have them taxi, a study was done and it did work out that it did save a lot? Yes they did experiment with towing planes, but it was not a viable option. The speed that an A/C can be towed is quite slow, and therefore the process slowed & messed-up Flight OPS. The big thing is now doing what is called single engine taxi, and it is just what it says. It is a whole lot cheaper to taxi on one engine than two. Other cost saving things being done now are fuel tankering, where you fill your tanks all the way up @ the airport where the fuel is the cheapest, and buy only what you need at where it's expensive. Also using Ground power as much as possible, because you save a ton by not running the APU. Plus being able to get direct approaches help with fuel costs. Hope this anwers your question...
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Post by Col7777 on Dec 7, 2008 10:24:41 GMT -5
Wow, you certainly are clued up qx, you've obviously read a lot on the subject, thanks for the info.
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Post by Tom/CalClassic on Dec 7, 2008 10:40:30 GMT -5
Stefan is in the industry.
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Post by bushpounder on Dec 7, 2008 14:36:37 GMT -5
Also, when you lease back an airplane, the facility usually guarantees you payment for X amount of hours per month, whether the plane flys that amount or not. IF it flys over that X amount, you also get paid for that. Maintenance expenses are usually worked out as well. The facility I used to work/fly for was a Piper / Aero Commander dealership. We had several aircraft on leaseback. Wish we could get the same deals today as back then. (the same prices!!)
Don
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