|
|
Post by carob on Jul 4, 2016 18:22:37 GMT -5
Hello.
I'm hoping someone can help me. I have installed the DC-7B and appropriate panel. Everything seems to have installed okay and the panel shows fine. I have also remove the "//" from the appropriate gauges but can't seem to get the engines to start using the procedure or Cntrl+E. The engines crank but won't start.
I'm hoping someone might be able to tell me what I'm doing wrong because I can't figure it out.
Thanks! |
|
|
|
Post by Dennis the menace on Jul 4, 2016 19:52:37 GMT -5
Do you have fuel in your tanks? Do you have your mixtures on full rich? Do you have "Automixture" enabled in your aircraft realism settings (it must be on)? If they crank and start but sputter and die, open your throttles some. If the engines are cold, they will not "catch" if the throttles are closed. Can you start your engines in manual mode using the panel?
|
|
|
|
Post by aerofoto on Jul 5, 2016 11:33:55 GMT -5
Precisely as "DENNIS THE MENACE" advises is the best procedure for a non-manual FS engine startup procedure for these propliners .... that´s the FS procedure using CTRL + E keyboard commands.
ALSO ....
With some FS installations .... it does/might pay to load the default MSFS CESSNA "first" and shut its engine down (if one wants to simulate a startup with the next aircraft selction) .... then .... before exiting the CESSNA in order to select ones DC-6/DC-7 of choice .... check that the CESSNA panel FUEL PUMP is selected to "ON", the MANGETOS SWITCH is set to "START", and the MIXTURE CONTROL set to "FULL/RICH" .... THEN .... go to ones DC-6/DC-7 of choice in order to start the engines using the FS CNTRL + E procedure.
As the first engine starts set the throttle for a slightly less than 1000 RPM indication on the engine RPM gauges .... then .... adjust the throttle and mixture setting "only after" all 4 engines have been started and appear to be running stable.
Too low a throttle or mixture setting during startup will ensure that the engines turn-over, but, fail to start .... just as "DENNIS THE MENACE" implies
The manual engine startup procedure for the DC-6/DC-7 are "BEST" (IMHO) .... but .... require a little more manipulation of switches and fuel levers, but, work superbly well too.
Mark C
HJG
|
|
|
|
Post by carob on Jul 5, 2016 20:02:07 GMT -5
Precisely as "DENNIS THE MENACE" advises is the best procedure for a non-manual FS engine startup procedure for these propliners .... that´s the FS procedure using CTRL + E keyboard commands. ALSO .... With some FS installations .... it does/might pay to load the default MSFS CESSNA "first" and shut its engine down (if one wants to simulate a startup with the next aircraft selction) .... then .... before exiting the CESSNA in order to select ones DC-6/DC-7 of choice .... check that the CESSNA panel FUEL PUMP is selected to "ON", the MANGETOS SWITCH is set to "START", and the MIXTURE CONTROL set to "FULL/RICH" .... THEN .... go to ones DC-6/DC-7 of choice in order to start the engines using the FS CNTRL + E procedure. As the first engine starts set the throttle for a slightly less than 1000 RPM indication on the engine RPM gauges .... then .... adjust the throttle and mixture setting "only after" all 4 engines have been started and appear to be running stable. Too low a throttle or mixture setting during startup will ensure that the engines turn-over, but, fail to start .... just as "DENNIS THE MENACE" implies The manual engine startup procedure for the DC-6/DC-7 are "BEST" (IMHO) .... but .... require a little more manipulation of switches and fuel levers, but, work superbly well too. Mark C HJG Tanks are full. Mixture is full rich. Throttles are open.
They do not start using Cntl+E or manually. However, I don't want to start them using Cnrl+E. The goal is to do it correctly. Which is why the instructions were followed to remove the "//" and enable the three gauges as mentioned in the documentation. Which should also prevent having to load another aircraft or reload the DC-7, correct?
|
|
|
|
Post by aerofoto on Jul 5, 2016 21:52:07 GMT -5
All of the initial procedures .... as first outlined by "DENNIS THE MENANCE" (and later myself also) .... are necessary as well as being pretty similar (if not identical) for a manual engine startup scenario.
In fact the only major differnce/s (and please note the following recommendations reflect my own personal procedures based on how these simulations are currently configured on my own system) are .... that the fuel/mixture levers are should be left in their low detente, and the Overhead sub panel engine selector switch, and engine starter switch, are used for engine startup .... and "not" CNTRL + E keyboard commands.
My procedure is ....
1. Attend to all the pre-requisite procedures as recommended by "DENNIS THE MENACE".
2. Set the Cowl Flaps to approx 4* (degrees) .... although the engine will start fine if these aren´t adjusted/set.
3. Check that each of the red fuel/mixture levers are set at their lowest detente.
4. Set throttle .... about 1/4 of its full detente.
5. Set engine starter selector on the Overhead sub panel to the desired engine number.
6. Hit/mouse click and depress (for a few moments) the starter switch on the Overhead sub panel.
7. As the selected engine begins to splutter into life/turn .... then .... advance the fuel/mixture lever for that particular engine .... to its full/rich detente (too slow or too low a response with the fuel/mixture lever will result in the engine turning, but not starting, and spluttering to stop/dying instead) .... and it should then burst into life and start purring away quite contetedly.
Repeat steps 5 - 7 (as described above) for each of the remaining 3 engines .... then .... re-adjust both the throttle and fuel/mixture levers after all 4 engines have been started and are running and stable.
Once again .... that´s the manual engine startup procedure I always used .... and which (for me) works faultlessly "every time" .... for both the DC-6 and DC-7 simulations.
If it doesn´t work, for you, then, you may have commented out (//) something valid during your said editing .... and which I can´t identify or offer further suggestion/s in regard to.
It´s still a good idea though to load a default MSFS aircraft type "prior to" selecting any add-on aircaft type (it simply ensures everything is set to the desirable basic/default FS setting) .... it´s just a helpful rather than essential procedure for some simulations. I, myself, do employ this recommendation as a standard procedure for every add-on simulation I fly.
Mark C
HJG
|
|
|
|
Post by herkpilot on Jul 5, 2016 23:22:21 GMT -5
Check that you have sufficient oil quantity in each engine. Low or no oil WILL prevent engine start. You may refill each tank by clicking on each gauge prior to attempting the start. I've struggled with this on more than a few times.
Good luck
|
|
|
|
Post by mrcapitalism on Jul 6, 2016 0:43:36 GMT -5
Are you using FSX/P3D? If so then the slow cranking gauges do not work.
|
|
|
|
Post by carob on Jul 6, 2016 17:22:23 GMT -5
All of the initial procedures .... as first outlined by "DENNIS THE MENANCE" (and later myself also) .... are necessary as well as being pretty similar (if not identical) for a manual engine startup scenario. In fact the only major differnce/s (and please note the following recommendations reflect my own personal procedures based on how these simulations are currently configured on my own system) are .... that the fuel/mixture levers are should be left in their low detente, and the Overhead sub panel engine selector switch, and engine starter switch, are used for engine startup .... and "not" CNTRL + E keyboard commands. My procedure is .... 1. Attend to all the pre-requisite procedures as recommended by "DENNIS THE MENACE". 2. Set the Cowl Flaps to approx 4* (degrees) .... although the engine will start fine if these aren´t adjusted/set. 3. Check that each of the red fuel/mixture levers are set at their lowest detente. 4. Set throttle .... about 1/4 of its full detente. 5. Set engine starter selector on the Overhead sub panel to the desired engine number. 6. Hit/mouse click and depress (for a few moments) the starter switch on the Overhead sub panel. 7. As the selected engine begins to splutter into life/turn .... then .... advance the fuel/mixture lever for that particular engine .... to its full/rich detente (too slow or too low a response with the fuel/mixture lever will result in the engine turning, but not starting, and spluttering to stop/dying instead) .... and it should then burst into life and start purring away quite contetedly. Repeat steps 5 - 7 (as described above) for each of the remaining 3 engines .... then .... re-adjust both the throttle and fuel/mixture levers after all 4 engines have been started and are running and stable. Once again .... that´s the manual engine startup procedure I always used .... and which (for me) works faultlessly "every time" .... for both the DC-6 and DC-7 simulations. If it doesn´t work, for you, then, you may have commented out (//) something valid during your said editing .... and which I can´t identify or offer further suggestion/s in regard to. It´s still a good idea though to load a default MSFS aircraft type "prior to" selecting any add-on aircaft type (it simply ensures everything is set to the desirable basic/default FS setting) .... it´s just a helpful rather than essential procedure for some simulations. I, myself, do employ this recommendation as a standard procedure for every add-on simulation I fly. Mark C HJG
Nothing was commented out. The commented out sections were commented in (a phrase???) per the documentation. Can you explain why the Automixture must be enabled in the aircraft realism settings? That doesn't make any sense to me if you are actually doing things the correct way. My understanding is that option is only really meant for people who don't want to manually work with the actual controls.
|
|
|
|
Post by Erik on Jul 7, 2016 8:32:41 GMT -5
In FS9, automixture should be off during realistic engine start by use of the special gauges concerned. Thereafter it is recommended on as those engines had automixture in real life (as per handling notes).
Ctrl-E however should have little to do with all that and should start the engines regardless of realism options, provided they can actually run (ref. fuel, oil levels et cetera). At least that is my understanding.
Erik
|
|
|
|
Post by carob on Jul 7, 2016 11:11:09 GMT -5
In FS9, automixture should be off during realistic engine start by use of the special gauges concerned. Thereafter it is recommended on as those engines had automixture in real life (as per handling notes). Ctrl-E however should have little to do with all that and should start the engines regardless of realism options, provided they can actually run (ref. fuel, oil levels et cetera). At least that is my understanding. Erik Exactly. So I don't understand why it doesn't work. Either I'm missing one of the special gauges (although everything came from the installer and otherwise appears to be fine) or they aren't working correctly or  .
I really don't know.
|
|
|
|
Post by hermankreimes on Jul 7, 2016 14:13:24 GMT -5
On some propliner simulations it is required to also to activate the engine primer at least 3 times before attempting to start.
Don't recall if this a requirement for the DC-7.
I am away from home for some time, so unfortunately I am not able to try this out and do a check.
Herman
|
|
|
|
Post by hermankreimes on Jul 7, 2016 15:23:54 GMT -5
From what I recall when last flying the DC-7C, and I suppose that the DC-7B is similar, I had to make sure that the Mixture\Fuel cut-of lever had to be in the full rich position in order to supply full fuel pressure to the engine prior to activating the start switch for that particular engine.
It is also possible that all 4 engine Mixture\ fuel cutt-off levers may have to be placed to the full rich position prior to start. JUst don't recall right now, but it seems to me that you had to depart some what from the original manual writeup procedure.
Herman
|
|
|
|
Post by aerofoto on Jul 7, 2016 20:08:23 GMT -5
I wasn´t going to further participate in this particular thread, but, just out of curiosity, I was going over some of the details posted above .... and which prompted me to conduct a number of tests. So far as I´m aware .... these DC-6 and DC-7 panels don´t feature any priming function Herman .... at least not beyond the O/H sub panel engine selector and starter switches. The MJ CONNIE panels most certainly do though .... and which is probably where you´re coming from  A couple of engine startup scenarios have been discussed above .... on the basis of (what I call) the auto-start procedure using SHIFT + E keyboard commands .... as well as the fully manual engine startup procedure (my personal preference) using the O/H sub panel engine selector and starter switches in company with the C/P sub pànel fuel/mixture levers too. Both of these engine startup scenarios work "b-e-a-u-t-i-f-u-l-l-y" .... in the case of my own FS2004 installation of these aircraft. One of the instructions "CAROB" is appears to be querying/debating is in regard to any necessity to activate "AUTO MIXTURE" among the FS settings options. "DENNIS THE MENNACE" earlier suggests activating it .... and "ERIK" advises that it shouldn´t matter whether or not "AUTO-MIXTURE" is selected "ON" or "OFF" .... because the engines should still start anyway, as commanded, and when using either scenario. On the basis of my own testing I conclude that both "DENNIS THE MENNACE" and "ERIK" are "quite correct" .... confirmed by a number of DC-6 and DC-7 startups I´ve just completed this evening .... so .... be it an authentic/desirable option or not .... engine startups appear to be unaided and unimpaired regardless whether or not the FS "AUTO-MIXTURE" option selected "ON" or "OFF". This then suggests (and please note I do say "SUGGEST" only) that something hasn´t been installed, or edited, correctly in the case of "CAROB´s" installation of the DC-7 simulation .... or .... during a manual engine startup scenario he may simply be engaging the fuel/mixture lever, for each engine, too slowly after having first begun turning each engine. Of course none of us can´t see what anyone else has done, so, at best we can usually only try´n guess. I can´t/won´t hazard any guess though as to why his engine startups are failing .... even when the auto-start option is applied .... other than to once again "suggest" something hasn´t been installed, edited, or configured correctly within his own installation, but, which I certainly can´t identify. Unless I´ve missed something ... "CAROB" also doesn´t state whether he´s an FS2004, FSX, or P3D user .... but .... my understanding (from another FS forum) is that he´s an FSX user .... and which might be quite relevant for reasons I´ll arrive at (below) in a moment. In regard to any editing of files for this simulation he does acknowledge the following recommended edits .... I assume the above edits, to which he refers, must be in regard to what´s stated within the "REALISTIC ENGINE START" document (among a number of other suggested optional edits) that accompany the this great DC-7 simulation, however, "IF" he´s an FSX user, as I recall may be the case, then, this document also clearly states as follows too .... .... suggesting, if I´m understanding everything correctly, that this authentic engine startup scenario isn´t available for FSX. "MRCAPITALISM" also earlier states .... .... and which tends to re-affirm such an FSX non-compatibility .... unless I´m missing something somewhere else. Whatever the problem may be .... I´m certainly out of any further ideas/advice to offer .... other than stating, that in the case of my own installation, I opted to keep the 3 gauges (implied within the documentation) commented out since I feel I´m getting excellent engine startup performances "AS-IS" .... certainly in accordance with the soundpack which I´ve chosen to use with these great simulations. I suggest "CAROB" should (possibly) "consider" doing the same. Mark C HJG |
|
|
|
Post by carob on Jul 8, 2016 9:43:45 GMT -5
This is for FS2004.
|
|
|
|
Post by Erik on Jul 8, 2016 11:02:30 GMT -5
Just to be sure, Ctrl-E still assigned to auto start? I lack other suggestions at the moment... [Edit] Just one more thing comes to mind, I had it with the DC-4 and 6 several times: battery depletion, for instance when gnd power did not switch correctly. You can check this under realism - failures - electrical system. Especially if a saved situation is used, this may repeat over and over. Erik |
|
.
